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but i'm a dog abusing thug

Prediction: Whichever party wins the dog-abusing thug vote will win the November election.

Handsome Jack Morrison
*gently remove the detonator to reply via e-mail
The Affirmative Action Myth:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,125729,00.html

History's verdict: The summers of 1944 and 2004:
http://www.nationalreview.com/hanson/hanson200407160827.asp

Hillary Clinton:"We're going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good."
The Anti-Idiotarian Rottweiler Little Green Footballs http://nicedoggie.net / http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog / Glenn Reynolds - InstaPundit Mark Steyn http://www.instapundit.com / http://www.steynonline.com / The Belmont Club Michelle Malkin http://belmontclub.blogspot.com / http://michellemalkin.com / Don Luskin Rightwing News http://www.poorandstupid.com/chronicle.asp http://www.rightwingnews.com / The Indepundit Victor Davis Hanson-Private Papers http://www.lt-smash.us / http://victorhanson.com/index.html
Yes many dogs feel a crate is a safe place. On the other hand there are those that go berserk in a crate and become aggressive. I have two dogs that do exactly that.
I used the crate as a puppy carrier and a house breaking aid and after that it was put away. I tried a few years ago to crate my older dog when I was going on a long car trip and he went totally nutso and I would never do it again. The other dog went and hid because she thought she was going to be stuck in the crate to. She didn't become aggressive but I could tell the stress of just thinking she was going in the thing was making her a wreck.

A crate can be a useful training tool but it shouldn't be used as a place to confine them because you can't leave them at home alone. If they are destructive when you are gone it's because of boredom. I would much rather see a dog confined to one room of the house where they can't get into trouble than stuck in a crate all day.
I agree a change in behavior like this needs a vet visit. If nothing is found then behavior training is called for but don't put anyone at risk till you find out what the problem is.
Celeste
(snipping is a Very Good Thing.)
A crate can be a useful training tool but it shouldn't be used as a place to confine them because you can't leave them at home alone.

i happen to think that that's one of the best uses for a crate. my animals' safety comes first.
If they are destructive when you are gone it's because of boredom.

that could be one cause.
(you obviously have no experience in dealing with a dog who has SA.)
I would much rather

what you prefer and what any particular dog prefers could well be miles apart. personally, i wouldn't roll in roadkill, but lots of dogs seem to think it's the bestest fun ever.
see a dog confined to one room of the house where they can't get into trouble than stuck in a crate all day.

some people don't have the luxury of having a room they can turn into a dog crate. and if they did, what's to keep the dog from chewing holes in the walls, doors, and floors? see, i've BTDT and it ain't pretty. i could've ended up with a dead dog, all because you would rather not see her crated. that seems unfair to me.

shelly (perfectly foul wench) and elliott and harriet http://home.bluemarble.net/~scouvrette
I tried a few years ago to crate my older dog when I was going on a long car trip and he went totally nutso and I would never do it again.

It's too bad that you couldn't properly orient him to a crate. IMO, on a long trip, crates are a more relaxing alternative to a seat belt harness (and my dogs - who slept the 3 hours back from a trial last night - agree).
How do you safely contain your dogs on car trips?

Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
Why would you keep a six year old dog in a kennel.

There could be several reasons. Maybe he can't be trusted alone in the house because he still chews electrical cords. Maybe he's more comfortable, less fearful in the crate when left for long periods. Some dogs are.
I am thinking how would you like to be put in a small cage and left. I suffer from fear on being closed in the thought makes me cringe.

That's because you're not a dog. Dogs are not little people in fur suits. Most dogs who are crate trained enjoy their crates, and go into them willingly. An exception may be a dog with separation anxiety. But in that case, it's still the separation from his human causing the reaction, not the confinement to the crate.
I understand the common misconception that crates are inhumane. Before I understood dogs as well as I do now, I used to believe the same thing. I now have not a shadow of a doubt that crates are a very valuable tool, pretty close to mandatory, and can actually enhance a dog's life.

Canine Action Dog Trainer
http://www.canineaction.com
My Kids, My Students, My Life:
http://hometown.aol.com/dfrntdrums/myhomepage/index.html
I used the crate as a puppy carrier and a house breaking aid and after that it was put away. ... but I could tell the stress of just thinking she was going in the thing was making her a wreck.

Then you obviously did not properly crate train your dogs. Dogs should never perceive their crates as something negative, at least not after the first few days/weeks of adjustment. Correctly used, most of them fairly quickly learn to enjoy their little "safe places."
Even if you do feel that you don't need to crate your dogs in your house, think about this. What happens if you have to go away in an emergency and they have to be boarded away from home? What if they get sick and have to stay overnight at the vet? Or you want to take your dog someplace you can only get to by airplane? Or how about if you just have to bring them to a groomer? In any case, they will be crated.
Do you want to add the stress of a scary new experience to the already scary new experience (being separated from you, in a strange place, with strange people)? Wouldn't you prefer that your dog had already learned that crate = safe place?
IMHO, it's cruel not to train a dog to enjoy a crate.

If they are
destructive when you are gone it's because of boredom. I would much rather see a dog confined to one room of the house where they can't get into trouble than stuck in a crate all day.

And what if the way he works out this boredom and anxiety is to chew on electrical cords? Or take apart the couch? Or dig up the rugs?

Instead, give him a stuffed and frozen kong to chew on in his crate. Put one of his meals in a buster cube in there. He'll have something fun to do that can't hurt him or destroy your house.
Canine Action Dog Trainer
http://www.canineaction.com
My Kids, My Students, My Life:
http://hometown.aol.com/dfrntdrums/myhomepage/index.html
She won't tolerate me taking the crate down and packing it away either as its her place, all her own, and where she feels safe.

heaven forbid! i rearranged some furniture and junk yesterday. the dogs were outside playing while i moved things around, which ... and she wiggled and pogoed and thoroughly inspected her crate. once she knew where it was, she was just fine.

I'm nor even allowed to do that. I can move the crate's location in the living room (as in from one side to the other) but I am not permitted to move its location to an entirely different room. There was a memo sent out that outlined all the rules in FancyWorld but I can't seem to find my copy at the moment. I do remember that rule being on it though.
She's not a unique case so I wish people would stop assuming that crated dogs are miserable or being cruelly treated.

i'd second that, but i'm a dog abusing thug, so i don't think it's likely to help your argument!

Everyone here, except Michael & Jerry, are dog abusing thugs so really you're weighing in on my thugology is probably a good thing. We thugs need to stick together.

Tara
It's too bad that you couldn't properly orient him to a crate. IMO, on a long trip, crates are a ... my dogs - who slept the 3 hours back from a trial last night - agree).> Matt. Rocky's a Dog.

My *&(&(* Explorer has been in the shop today, so driving the non-dog car. Franklin has only been in the non-dog car once. He wasn't impressed that time and he wasn't impressed today, even though he was happy to see it delivered him to agility class. He stayed in a down on the back seat the whole way, but panted heavily. I coul almost hear "where's my nice cozy crate" over and over. He hops into his car crate and snoozes, but this back seat thing? He'd rather not thank you.
Janet Boss
http://bestfriendsdogobedience.com /
"Tee"
You and gswork are assuming the dog doesn't like being crated. Many dogs do, particularly if they were raised that ... this scenario has to be viewed negatively or as though the owner is somehow abusing the dog is beyond me.

While I have no problem with the judicious use of crates, the idea of a dog being crated for 12hrs or so at a time with only an hour break bothers me. It really doesn't seem healthy. Granted, this may not be the case on a day to day basis, but it appears to be when they go on vacation. If the dog is crated when no one is there, and only the pet sitter is coming into the house to care for the dog twice per day (assuming here. And most visits are
45 - 60m) that's a lot of crate time. I would rather see a dog at a kennel.

-Andrea Stone
Saorsa Basenjis
http://home1.gte.net/res0s12z/
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