I finally had a chance to try out the eye game with Harriet. Oh. My. God.It took about four or five repetitions for her to get the idea that eye contact = treat. Then, I started tossing the kibble in random places instead of right at her, but still in front of me. We did that 5-6 times, and she was very good at returning to sit in front of me and finding my eyes. Then I started tossing the kibble over my shoulder. There is an old chunk of mirror on the floor at the end of the room, so I was able to watch in it to see what she was doing back there.

She was staring very intently at my head, sitting. Then she tried downing, still staring at the back of my head. After awhile, I decided we'd be there all night, so I stepped backwards, into her, to force her to move. She jumped around me, landed in front of me, and found my eyes.
This is where clumsiness of handler is a handicap. I had a hard time tossing the treats behind me without turning around and looking. I made a few goof-ups that I'm sure slowed her down. However, she did pretty well, I thought. After she got the idea that she had to come around* me, I started moving in a circle. I was *amazed that she caught on immediately, and moved right with me, with eyes locked on mine.

This was turning clockwise. I switched to counter clockwise, and her brane started to melt down. Since I was moving into her, and not away, she boinked up in the air a couple of times. She did figure it out, but it was more difficult for her. I decided to stop (on a high note!) because I wanted to make sure to end before she'd totally lost her brane.

Not bad, I think, considering who she has to work with. I was amazed at how patient she was when she first was behind me. I would have sworn she'd have thrown some sort of hissy fit, but she was very collected. Intense but collected. I'm also impressed at how quickly she initially figured out eye contact = treat.

Also, I didn't use stinky treats or anything just plain ol' kibble. Treats are kind of overkill for Harriet. She's plenty motivated by kibble, and treats just make her so keyed up that she loses control of her brane.
Next, the Thought Control Ray of Dqqm(tm)!

Shelly
http://www.cat-sidh.net (the Mother Ship)
http://esther.cat-sidh.net (Letters to Esther)
The most fundamental reason one paints is in order to see. Brett Whiteley
I finally had a chance to try out the eye game with Harriet. Oh. My. God.

Harder than you think, isn't it?
She was staring very intently at my head, sitting. Then she tried downing, still staring at the back of my ... into her, to force her to move. She jumped around me, landed in front of me, and found my eyes.

Good training choice!
This is where clumsiness of handler is a handicap. I had a hard time tossing the treats behind me without ... down. Since I was moving into her, and not away, she boinked up in the air a couple of times.

I'm finding this with Cala too. It's easy for her to move to my left, toward heel position. It's hard for her to move to my right, away from heel position. And I don't think she really gets that she has to solicit eye contact yet. But we're getting there. She seems to start cold then "get it," and when she's getting it it's fun, because then I can just stop and move her with my eyes, without moving my body. Right now I still need to move my head though.
Also, I didn't use stinky treats or anything just plain ol' kibble. Treats are kind of overkill for Harriet. She's plenty motivated by kibble, and treats just make her so keyed up that she loses control of her brane. Next, the Thought Control Ray of Dqqm(tm)!

Heh.
Harder than you think, isn't it?

It is! But watching the light bulb go off in Harriet's head was beautiful.
She seems to start cold then "get it," and when she's getting it it's fun, because then I can just stop and move her with my eyes, without moving my body.

That's the next step, though I think there will be quite a bit of restarting at square one. That's okay. It's a very fun game to play while doling out the lunch and dinner kibble.
Right now I still need to move my head though.

One thing I'm having trouble with and this is a good example of why working with someone is an advantage is not turning my head and looking for Harriet's eyes. Duh! But I keep finding myself doing it, and have to mentally smack myself for it. It's also difficult for me to tell when she's found my eyes without cheating and moving them to her.

Shelly
http://www.cat-sidh.net (the Mother Ship)
http://esther.cat-sidh.net (Letters to Esther)
Creationists make it sound as though a 'theory' is something you dreamt up after being drunk all night.
Isaac Asimov
One thing I'm having trouble with and this is a good example of why working with someone is an advantage is not ... it. It's also difficult for me to tell when she's found my eyes without cheating and moving them to her.

I found myself having exactly the same problem.
It caused me to realize I was MUCH farther away from accomplishing this than I had thought. So, I'm starting the focus exercises from scratch and having Annie hold eye contact for 3 seconds if there are no distractions, one or two if we're on the street or on an elevator. For that part, she doesn't have to fully seek it since I am looking at her, and she just has to bring her focus to my own eyes that are already there. Cuz, yeah..it turned out that if I didn't cheat for her, it didn't happen. I took that as a clear sign that she wasn't ready and that I had to be much more specific about what the actual starting criteria was.
I was going to clarify this with Robin as well (I couldn't find the actual exercise she's doing with Cala on Sue's Watch page), but my assumption is that I would know* that Annie got it right specifically *because I wouldn't have to look towards her to see if she got it right: if she got it right, she'd be staring directly into my pupils, and I'd be (by definition) staring back. But I'm nowhere near getting this with Little Miss yet, so I'd be curious about the specifics of that.
Also, I was curious about how to go about making certain you don't move your eyes. Do you stare at a specific spot on the ground and wait for the dog to enter that field of vision and meet your eyes there? Or is it more of a soft focus thing?
Tara
I was going to clarify this with Robin as well (I couldn't find the actual exercise she's doing with Cala ... back. But I'm nowhere near getting this with Little Miss yet, so I'd be curious about the specifics of that.

For this particular exercise (and not, it's not specified on Sue's site), the dog should move directly into your area and seem focused upward, then you can move your eyes to see if the dog is truly looking at you. I think it's getting the dog to "lock on." Later, of course, you do want the dog to keep looking at you even when you look away, but at first the game is to find your eyes, lock on, and get rewarded.

Sue does associate the word command of "Watch" with this.
Also, I was curious about how to go about making certain you don't move your eyes. Do you stare at ... to enter that field of vision and meet your eyes there? Or is it more of a soft focus thing?

For me it's looking ahead, soft focus. When Cala was having a difficult time once, I actually took both hands and cupped them by my eyes so she couldn't see my eyes unless she moved in front of me.