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Fine. They do because they can. Not a lot of detail, but certainly comprehensive.

Now you're just being silly.

Not at all. You "like" the simplest form, and that's it.
A dog COULD jump off the roof. Obviously it doesn't

And you know this because ... ?
because it does not fit into any of the categories either you or I have established.

Nonsense. As in, that makes no sense. A dog's behavior doesn't depend on categories postulated by a human.
A dog could jump off the roof. Or a roof. It might (because it can), or it might not (because it can do otherwise). Categories or not, I suspect it makes little difference to the dog.

Mary H. and the Ames National Zoo: Regis, Sam-I-Am, Noah (1992-2001), Ranger, Duke,
felines, and finches
god, They don't have to, self preservation is instinct in ... preservation, the latter being the generativity side of the "self."

I would agree that self preservation is an instinct in all animals, and never said otherwise. Also, self-preservation has more ... enjoy food, water and sex afterward if you avoid getting squished doesn't mean they were motivations in avoiding getting squished.

If you think of it all from a conditioning standpoint, it doesn't mean that they weren't "motivations" either. The animal operates upon the environment, the environement is changed and in turn, the animal is changed. Now the animal is more apt to react differently to the environment, due to the change in the animal. This precludes conscious reason but the consequences of sex, food, water, could very possibly reinforce behaviors that cause an animal to avoid being squished.

To say that "you are motivated to not get squished, because you don't want to get squished", is saying nothing more than 'you don't want to be squished' a perfectly fine description of behavior, but a very poor explanation for behavior. It does not explain why you avoid being squished, or even what causes you to not "want" to be squished. For such an explanation we look to conditioning of the organism by the environment, and even over an evolutionary history.
Re above. They don't need to "know," it's built into their genetics.

Yes, that is exactly what I am saying. You seem to be saying the end result correlates directly with the ... a dog likes/dislikes something, they like/dislike something, and it doesn't matter what the evolutionary benefit is (in terms of training/motivation).

So when we go for an explanation for why the dog likes or dislikes something, do we just stop with "well it does, and that's it" ? Or do we look to other causes for such patterns of behavior?
If like

Fine. They do because they can. Not a lot of detail, but certainly comprehensive.

Now you're just being silly. A dog COULD jump off the roof. Obviously it doesn't because it does not fit into any of the categories either you or I have established.

Wanna bet - if a dog is on the roof I'm not laying any money down that it will stay up there and not jump. That's right, even if it is likely to get killed doing so.
Diane Blackman
Problem is if you are think "food" when trying to work out operantly conditioning the behavior of a dog in herding training you will very likely be seeking completely ineffective solutions. Because a sheepdog presented with a flock of sheep is not interested in eating nor, nor sex, nor water, nor even pleasing its pack members a good part of the time. Reducing it down to its simplest element will very likely interfere with your identification of the true motivator. If all you seek is simple then there is really only one motivator and that is to live.

Diane Blackman
Now you're just being silly. A dog COULD jump off the roof.

or try to jump out a 2nd story window, for example.
Obviously it doesn't because it does not fit into any of the categories either you or I have established.

you honestly can't conceive of a dog doing something that is in direct conflict with it's best interests simply because it has a drive that makes it do things that don't fit within your "categories"? there are drives that override the basic survival drives.

shelly (perfectly foul wench) and elliott and harriet http://home.bluemarble.net/~scouvrette