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She lives in Perth, Australia. I live in Austin, Texas. I believe we are appoximately 10,000 miles apart. And she is with a very controlling man who will NOT allow her to give me the phone number or their address.

Oh, Gwen. I'm sorry. I wasn't hearing the stuff about your daughter, because the stuff about your parents was hitting so close to home. I didn't realize the rift between you was this severe.
I think she feels I shorted her. I don't like too much touchy feely but she needed that. And she always did.

Do you think this is what it's all about? That you didn't hug her enough? Or is there something else happening?
Besides hugging, what other ways did you show her you loved her?
I have told her time and again I am sorry.

Then stop telling her. It's not what she wants or needs, and not what's going to open up the lines of communication between you.

How about if you ask her to get a PO Box so you could start writing to each other? Would that be feasible?
Canine Action Dog Trainer
http://www.canineaction.com
My Kids, My Students, My Life:
http://hometown.aol.com/dfrntdrums/myhomepage/index.html
She lives in Perth, Australia. I live in Austin, Texas. ... her to give me the phone number or their address.

Oh, Gwen. I'm sorry. I wasn't hearing the stuff about your daughter, because the stuff about your parents was hitting so close to home. I didn't realize the rift between you was this severe.

It's not that. He won't allow it. He is 44 years old. She will be 22 in Dec.
She would be willing to give me her number, addy everything.

He supports her. She can't work, they aren't married. She isn't an Australian citizen. He hasn't married her yet they have a child. She depends completely on him for everything. I can't even fathom that sort of dependence on any human being. It would drive me completely over
the edge.
I think she feels I shorted her. I don't like too much touchy feely but she needed that. And she always did.

Do you think this is what it's all about? That you didn't hug her enough? Or is there something else happening?

There's more. Her father who she adores and I depise. And my DH wouldn't allow me to communicate with
him because of his jealousy. So that caused some issues as the ex wanted nothing more then to hurt me and
drive a wedge between my kids and I because I left him.

And she never accepted my DH and in some ways I believe she hates him. And he loved her and still does. But he did feel like he got screwed for lack of appreciation
for all the things he did. Its very long story really.
Besides hugging, what other ways did you show her you loved her?

Probably not enough. Maybe I don't even know how.
I have told her time and again I am sorry.

Then stop telling her. It's not what she wants or needs, and not what's going to open up the lines ... writing to each other? Would that be feasible? Canine Action Dog Trainer http://www.canineaction.com My Kids, My Students, My Life: http://hometown.aol.com/dfrntdrums/myhomepage/index.html

We talked about that last evening. She said it was in her plans but again the man she is with has to pay for everything and I am not so sure he cares
if any of us in US contact her. Besides I think
he wants to keep close tabs.
She told me last evening that on Mondays
Cory goes to his parents house so she
can clean and that IRONING took
her the longest. I said ironing? Ironing
what? She said she had to iron
all of his shirts, even t-shirts
and work out t-shirts. I said that
was obsurd. I know I probably shouldn't
have said a single word as that probably
sounded like my dad. But this should
illustrate what lifestyle she is living.
IMO, but I would never tell her
that is my definition of "hell".
Gwen
Its very long story really.

Yes, and very complex. These things are never simple. :}

I just wanted to make sure you weren't taking the blame for the whole thing because you didn't hug her enough.
Besides hugging, what other ways did you show her you loved her?

Probably not enough. Maybe I don't even know how.

I highly doubt this. Well, maybe that you don't know how - I sometimes wonder if anybody human knows how. But I doubt that you didn't have ways of showing that you loved her.
Did you offer help when she was in crisis? Did you show interest in her school work? Did you purposely cook things you knew she liked to eat?
How about if you ask her to get a PO Box so you could start writing to each other? Would that be feasible?

We talked about that last evening. She said it was in her plans but again the man she is with ... sure he cares if any of us in US contact her. Besides I think he wants to keep close tabs.

He's classic. Very often men with control issues try to cut off all communication with the outside world. They want to be the only one who has any influence.
Actually, it's not just men who do it. They can do it more easily, because they can use physical force, and I believe most women are programmed to be more subservient than most men are. I know a controlling woman who pulled the same thing on her husband. She went so far as to tell him that his closest friend tried to seduce her, and succeeded in breaking his ties with the one person who had influence over him for a year.
So you two do still have a close bond. That's great, a relief to hear.

You want my $.02 thumbnail sketch that could be completely off the mark? Take with tablespoon of salt. When she's being venomous to you, it's because she wants you to save her. Not consciously, subconsciously. She's got herself into this predicament, and she wants mommy to get her out. And mommy can't, so she resents it.
Canine Action Dog Trainer
http://www.canineaction.com
My Kids, My Students, My Life:
http://hometown.aol.com/dfrntdrums/myhomepage/index.html
it takes a LOT of therapy to start to understand that we can't control everything, that we aren't responsible for everything, and that we don't have to feel bad/responsible for everything that happens around us. -kelly

That's precisely very true. And the amount of therapy is more then I have time of money to spend. And finding a good
one is a whole other ball game too. Many therapist become therapist because they are screwed up. That is often why they became interested in the career in the first place.
Without insurance, which is very possible on my horizon it isn't even feasible. For one if I don't have insurance it means I don't have a job. If I get another job it quite possible it will be one without insurance.
And at a very low pay. In fact I can forsee working
2 jobs.

Gwen
this is the number one reason i don't want hooman children. :-)[/nq]I came from a not so great background. I was in state foster care for a few stretches due to an unstable and neglectful home situation. My dad was an alcoholic and my mother was schizophrenic (multiple long term hospitalizations when she had catatonic episodes). When sober my dad was actually a very kind hearted guy but when he drank he had a mean tongue. When he went to bars, he often left me in the car for hours. Pretty boring and which is the reason I think I became such a big reader.

Anyway, when I graduated from high school I looked back at my puppyhood, said "well that kinda sucked" and went on with my life. Some folks, like some rescue dogs, can come out of less-than-ideal situations and turn out OK, maybe not optimum but still pretty darn OK. With my upbringing, one would think I would truly suck at personal relationships but I'm in year 19 of a happy marriage to a great guy and I'm an good enough mother to my son. I think I came out of it fine, partly due to my basic temperament.

I'm by nature a matter-of-fact, pragmatic kind of person. When something is broke I look at it, think about it and get it fixed, or fixed enough to get by. I never had much trouble differnciately between the nasty things my dad said and reality (or the incredibly weird things my mother said and reality). I have read that having animals when growing up can help tremendously for a child to learn how to form attachments and love appropriately. I think that is really true, my two dogs and cat were my closest and most sane family members.

The only problem with having pets is that they severely limited my foster home options (very few foster homes will take a kid AND her pets) and I decided that I'd rather stay at home with Sigh (my little GSD cross), Buffy the Basset (no I didn't named her) and Kit Carson (a handsome Holstein patterned cat) than stay with a foster family without them. (In case you're wondering, when a kid reaches her/his late adolescent/teen years, the foster care system lets them have a say in their placement).Amway, what I'm getting to is about having kids if one has not had an ideal childhood. My theory is to look at your current relationships to people and to animals. Can you (not necessarily you Kelly but a generic you) form healthy attachments? In my case I held off having a child until I was 36. Partly because when I was a kid my parents couldn't cope and I ended up taking care of them. From that I extremely leery of taking on that level of responsibility again.

And by the time I was 35, I had had time to practice my parenting skills on my collies. Well maybe not all the various types of parenting duties (never was able to teach Dino to eat soup from a spoon without slurping) but I was able to see how, now as an adult, I handled being in charge of another creature. Yes Dogs are not Kids and Kids are not Dogs but I think that parenting skills can be learned & developed. I was able to look at my experiences with my collies and realize that many of the qualities that made me a good dog owner also were critical skills for being a parent.

So when I had Soren, I knew that while I was deficient in some mothering talents (such as knowing nursery rhymes or being able to sing sweetly), but I knew that I was able to love in a healthy way, stay level-headed under stress and keep my sense of humor.

Well this is waaay more than I had intended to write. I had planned on jotting a few notes but this post got away from me. Hope I didn't bore you too much.
Chris and her two smoothies
Pablo and Lucy
Perhaps it would be a good time to get them some help, too.

She lives in Perth, Australia. I live in Austin, Texas. I believe we are appoximately 10,000 miles apart. And she ... daughter has ended up with such a controlling man. I hope all of you come through the rough times okay.

Paula
"The smell of burning rubber chickens and
singed roller-skating chimps will teach a man to hate." swt
IMO, this is a good example of why I think the word "abuse" has lost all of its meaning. It like the word "drive." It means different things to different people, all of whom otherwise speak the same language. Emotion: smile

I'd like to add to the list of highly charged words that have taken on so many different meanings as to become meaningless. How about:

natural,
feminism,
addicted,
politically correct,
vegetarian?
(And now responding to the whole thread, not just Jack's post.)
Mulitiple personality disorder and repressed memory syndrome have now been debunked. There's no difference between a repressed memory and forgetting something. Mulitiple personality is no different from being moody or spacy.
Lia
He has never heard them say it. It is always on the phone. It is basically them being angry I ... like leaving any of my animals. I tell him and he just rolls his eyes. And says that their problem.

He's right.
Indeed. I feel sorry for them. I really don't think they know what they do. My SIL and I talk ... Maybe I did the above in hopes that it would be him that cut off the ties and not me?

Heh. Maybe so. It sounds as though your dad never speaking to you again wouldn't be such a bad thing. Certainly that's what my friend is hoping for right now. Your dad forgets that these are your relatives too, and he's not the one who gets to decide what you tell people.
Mustang Sally
Yes indeed. And it's very important to validate yourself by ... really possible to heal and rebuild self-esteem without doing that.

In adulthood, my relationship with my parents became healthy. My mother and I became very close. But it took therapy ... father and he went home. But she didn't get a reaction out of me. So she never did it again.

So operant conditioning works on inappropriate parental behavior too!

Mustang Sally
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