Hi all,
Last week, i adopted a puppy from my local animal shelter. He was a stray lab/terrier mix that was about 8 weeks old when he was brought into the shelter. No one knows how long he had been on his own. I noticed when handling him in the shelter that he had no bite inhibition. (His mouthing was hard) My wife and I however, loved him, and decided to adopt him so taht he can be trained properly.
We suspect taht very early on, he was either taken from his litter mates too soon or that he was handled roughly by his previous owners then dumped on the street when he bit back. He plays VERY hard and his bites even when friendly lack control.
Every day my wife and i train him using positive / luring. He has picked up very quickly (very food motivated) coming when called , go get it, and sit to the point where he follows us around sitting thinking he's getting a treat. He is an adorable puppy.
however, a few times a day, he will get super riled up and start biting our feet and hands. Also, he nips at everyone he meets taht tries to pet him. we have done much research on this and decided to try to teach him bite control on our own, but yelling ouch with him or withdrawing attention seems to get him riled up more to the point where he'll chase us and bite us. Because of this we tried giving him tiemouts in both a bathroom and his crate.
He also does not like being picked up and will try to bite his way down. In fact, he bites when im playing wiht hi spaws sometimes ( though not as hard) and when im trying to get him used to being handled. We took him to the vet on the weekend because of a respiratory infectino, and he all but freaked out on the vet lashing out and biting.
Ive tried redirecting him to his toys which will work when he's not determined to bite us, but other times he will ignore the toy and go for our limbs or face. Ive also tried holign his muzzle closed but he all but attacked me after that. The only thing that seems to work is to squirt him with a water gun. He doesnt get riled up but stops when he gets squirted.

We had a trainer come to our house this week to asses him, but he was sick with his infection so he was sleeping most of the time and she assesed his behavior as normal pup mouthing. She did not see his vicious streak. We have her coming again on friday so hoepfully she will be able to see him at his 'worst'.
if anyone has any suggestions or comments, please help us. We are almost in tears trying to correct and train this lovable, intelligent puppy and fear that we are doing him more harm than good.
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Last week, i adopted a puppy from my local animal shelter. He was a stray lab/terrier mix that was about ... hard) My wife and I however, loved him, and decided to adopt him so taht he can be trained properly.

Yayyy!!
We suspect taht very early on, he was either taken from his litter mates too soon or that he was ... dumped on the street when he bit back. He plays VERY hard and his bites even when friendly lack control.

When Moogli was young, he also played very rough. Most puppies do. The sharp, pointy puppy teeth don't help either. Note that all of my advice below is based on what worked for us. It may or may not work for you. I am not a trainer, professional handler, yada yada yada.
however, a few times a day, he will get super riled up and start biting our feet and hands. Also, ... chase us and bite us. Because of this we tried giving him timeouts in both a bathroom and his crate.

When you ignore him, how long do you ignore him for?? It seems to me (and I am not a trainer, so take this for what you are paying for it) that he has learned that if he bites harder/more often, he gets attention. The yelling ouch (or just squealing in a high-pitched tone) should work, but it takes a while. It may get slightly worse before it gets better.
He also does not like being picked up and will try to bite his way down. In fact, he bites ... the weekend because of a respiratory infectino, and he all but freaked out on the vet lashing out and biting.

When Moogli was very little, he didn't like being petted. He would try to bite and attack our hands. As he gets older (he will be 2 in august) he is calming way down. For the vet thing, he may have been freaked out by the vet. Perhaps your vet has no bedside manner and spent most of the time looming over the puppy? I know our first vet, once we put Moogli in the room, put him onthe floor and allowed him to wander around the examination room for about 5 minutes. Then, we picked him up, put him on the table, and the vet crouched down so that he was at the same eye level as Moogli and gave him a treat to eat while Moogli was being examined.
Ive tried redirecting him to his toys which will work when he's not determined to bite us, but other times ... is to squirt him with a water gun. He doesnt get riled up but stops when he gets squirted.

That is what we used to get Moogli to stop barking in the apartment. Does he like peanut butter?? That is another thing we tried with Moolgi that had some success. We(I) would smear a bunch of peanut butter on my finger and give it to him. Then, we would say "give a kiss" just before he would start licking it off. I would keep on repeating give a kiss every 10 seconds or so as long as there was pb on my finger. He is now at the point where, if he is totally wired and we are fighting/wrestling, I can tell him to give me a kiss and he will spin and lick my nose (no teeth) and then spin back and try to kill my hand.
if anyone has any suggestions or comments, please help us. We are almost in tears trying to correct and train this lovable, intelligent puppy and fear that we are doing him more harm than good.

Good luck. Have you started checking out local resources for your pup? Training classes, dog parks, that sort of thing??
Marcel
When Moogli was young, he also played very rough. Most puppies do. The sharp, pointy puppy teeth don't help either. ... for us. It may or may not work for you. I am not a trainer, professional handler, yada yada yada.

Thanks for your advice. I am well aware that puppy mouthing can be painful. However, even our dog walker was astounded by the 'clamping down' of his play bites. I've been around many puppies adn have had a puppy before. This little guys play bites are HARD. Just wanted to clarify that.

in both a bathroom and his crate.
When you ignore him, how long do you ignore him for?? It seems to me (and I am not a ... in a high-pitched tone) should work, but it takes a while. It may get slightly worse before it gets better.

We ignore him for about a minute untl we let him out and ask for obedience commands and treats. The yelling ouch seems to get him riled up. This guy would injure us if it got any worse. When he's calm he responds to the 'ouch' by letting off a bit, but when he's riled up, ouch is an understatement.
He also does not like being picked up and will ... but freaked out on the vet lashing out and biting.

Perhaps your vet has no bedside manner and spent most of the time looming over the puppy?

Yes the vet was a real jerk actually.
That is what we used to get Moogli to stop barking in the apartment. Does he like peanut butter??

No he doesnt'. he doesnt like kong stuffing either. Our trainer was astonished.
That is another thing we tried with Moolgi that had some success. We(I) would smear a bunch of peanut butter ... and he will spin and lick my nose (no teeth) and then spin back and try to kill my hand.

i will try to find something that he likes that he can lick. Thanks for the suggestion.
Good luck. Have you started checking out local resources for your pup? Training classes, dog parks, that sort of thing??

Yes, we've checked out every and any local classes, parks, etc. We are having once a week personal in home sessions with a 'positive' trainer.
We are having once a week personal in home sessions with a 'positive' trainer.

Don't be surprised if you don't stop the biting then. Judicious correction is a good thing and saves lives.
Janet Boss
http://bestfriendsdogobedience.com /
When Moogli was young, he also played very rough. Most ... I am not a trainer, professional handler, yada yada yada.

Thanks for your advice. I am well aware that puppy mouthing can be painful. However, even our dog walker was ... many puppies adn have had a puppy before. This little guys play bites are HARD. Just wanted to clarify that.

Does your dog walker have other puppies, o rknow where some are?? It moght be an option (and I am aware of some of the possible health risks of doing this, but weigh the pros and cons yourself) to let the puppies play together, or perhaps with an older dog that is known to be gentle with puppies. Your pup will learn, very quickly, that biting gets either ignoring (by puppies or older dog) or punishment (by older dog). But this is just a guess.
When you ignore him, how long do you ignore him ... while. It may get slightly worse before it gets better.

We ignore him for about a minute untl we let him out and ask for obedience commands and treats. The ... calm he responds to the 'ouch' by letting off a bit, but when he's riled up, ouch is an understatement.

Ignore harder is my only suggestion. He has to realize that biting gets him no response. As soon as he pauses in his play/attack, turn and respond with praise. (Get help from a trainer on this to make sure you get the timing right)
Perhaps your vet has no bedside manner and spent most of the time looming over the puppy?

Yes the vet was a real jerk actually.

Find a new vet if at all possible. Life is soo much easier when your dog isn't trying to kill your vet.
That is what we used to get Moogli to stop barking in the apartment. Does he like peanut butter??

No he doesnt'. he doesnt like kong stuffing either. Our trainer was astonished.

Other things to try that may work: Cheese whiz, Liver pate, processed cheese. Use your imagination. There will be something that he will like.
Good luck. Have you started checking out local resources for your pup? Training classes, dog parks, that sort of thing??

Yes, we've checked out every and any local classes, parks, etc. We are having once a week personal in home sessions with a 'positive' trainer.

Positive trainer?? What do you mean by positive??
Marcel
We are having once a week personal in home sessions with a 'positive' trainer.

Don't be surprised if you don't stop the biting then. Judiciouscorrection is a good thing and saves lives.

Can you explain a littel bit please?
Can you explain a littel bit please?

Sure. I don't believe that redirect and bribing is the answer. I think redirect is an ELEMENT of teaching the puppy not to bite, but no correction of any sort, while it sounds good and is a trend, is not the way a puppy will learn.
We all have limits and corrections in life. Speed limits, traffic lights - obey them or suffer consequences.
I;ve never found the "squeal" response to puppy teeth all that effective or appropriate, but for some it works ok. I don't pull back, but issue a verbal correction - anything from an "ahtt" to a "NOO" depending on the level of bite asnd/or lunging. I want the puppy to learn to yield to me, not the other way around. I don't turn and ignore puppies - I want them to learn how to interact with my face appropriately. If you pull your hand away, or turn away, many puppies think it's a big ole game and keep trying and leaping harder. My hand doesn't move. I use my voice to get puppy to move off of it, and a physical correction if necessary. It rarely is.
"pure positive" is a myth. Your dog needs for you to tell him something isn't acceptable, in clear terms, not wave hotdogs in his face (and he doesn't seem very food, or at least PB motivated).
Janet Boss
http://bestfriendsdogobedience.com /
Thanks for your advice. I am well aware that puppy mouthing can be painful. However, even our dog walker was ... many puppies adn have had a puppy before. This little guys play bites are HARD. Just wanted to clarify that.

I haven't followed all of this so forgive me if this doesn't even apply, but I do have a good way to help stop puppy biting. When the puppy bites, I simply put my finger right behind his lower canines and gently press DOWN while calmly saying "no bite." It will soon be very uncomfortable for him, because he'll find he can't close his mouth. He'll start waling his head around, trying to get away so he can close his mouth. You can then gently release. If he immediately comes back for more, same treatment.
I've found this method to be successful with every puppy I've ever tried it on. Not only does it teach them that biting is something you don't like, it also teaches them to drop their mouth open when your fingers get in there. The key is to exert GENTLE but constant pressure downward, trying to push the jaw back toward the neck. You don't want to jerk or use all your power.
Does your dog walker have other puppies, o rknow where some are?? It moght be an option (and I am ... biting gets either ignoring (by puppies or older dog) or punishment (by older dog). But this is just a guess.

We are going to take him to puppy class as SOOn as he's over his kennel cough. he did however, play with a 1 year old beagle puppy that put him in his place with nose nudging when he got out of hand. It didnt seem to help but nonetheless, we are going to continue bringing him to more than one puppy class a week to try to fix this. Most puppy classses hwoever require all vaccinations. My pup only has his first set.
Ignore harder is my only suggestion. He has to realize that biting gets him no response. As soon as he pauses in his play/attack, turn and respond with praise. (Get help from a trainer on this to make sure you get the timing right)

I understand the principle behind this. However, in practice when he's riled up, I dont see any other way of ignoring him other than placing him somehwere alone. I think this carrying him to isolation has reinforced teh biting. This is why we started using the water pistol.
Find a new vet if at all possible. Life is soo much easier when your dog isn't trying to kill your vet.

Yes, our regular vet is very nice. This jerk was in emergency care.
Other things to try that may work: Cheese whiz, Liver pate, processed cheese. Use your imagination. There will be something that he will like.

Thank you.
Positive trainer?? What do you mean by positive??

I mean a trainer that uses positive reinforcement as opposed to a choke / remote collar.
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