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That said, I wouldn't personally crate a dog because he was muddy. Pre-work outings are strictly supervised, but if it did happen,

avoiding the mud after the rain is not really possible where I live
the dog would be quickly rinsed off (if I'm late for work, it's not a big deal, but I realize others do not have that luxury) or

I can't be late for work unless its a good reason.
I would just take the consequences of having a dirty house (again, I have the luxury of answering to no one but myself).

a wet muddy dog on my bed is harder and more time consuming to deal with them a putting him in the crate. when I got home, he got a bath (which ironically was on the plans for that day anyway) and then I could spend time playing with him because I didn't need to clean up a messy room. I think given the choices, he would have chosen the crate, bath and play option over the other one anyway.
I don't know about that. Some multiple dogs may entertain ... need to keep a dog occupied when they are home.

True, but I don't think food is a particularly good way to go about that!

I think it depends on the dogs.
Who says it needs to be meaningful? Dogs should not ... their senses, and any resulting problems have been sorted out.

I agree, but does that take an hour? Jenny seemed to indicated that she thought he was realizing she was *** during that time, and I doubt that he was.

he doesn't HATE the crate, but its not his favorite place either. he may not have enjoyed it in there as much as being out playing but dogs, like people, can't always get what they want. he may or may not have been *** and may or may not have realized why he was there but I am ok with it either way.
That said, I wouldn't personally crate a dog because he ... have the luxury of answering to no one but myself).

True. I hate seeing dogs crated all day, especially through no "fault" of their own. I love crates and advocate crate training, and use them in the car on a daily basis.

I don't like crating a dog all day either for no good reason. My decision was something I can live with and Maui doesn't seem to have suffered for it. FWIW, I was only gone about 2 hours anyway so it wasn't all day. I just had to run some paperwork to the office and go to a meeting, no clients/appointments that day!
But I also think they get used because someone can't be bothered handling the situation in a more productive way.

I am sure I could think of a more productive option for almost any situation but not always a practical or feasible one.
I can't be late for work unless its a good reason.

I realize that. I'm not saying that I think you made bad choices, just that they are different from the choices I would have made, in part, because I do not have the same restrictions on my time that others like you usually have. I also do not have a dog with a high-maintenance coat.

Shelly
http://www.cat-sidh.net (the Mother Ship)
http://esther.cat-sidh.net (Letters to Esther)
I agree, but does that take an hour? Jenny seemed ... *** during that time, and I doubt that he was.

I have, on occasion, told the dogs to get away from me and stay away, until I've cooled down. I ... dogs always know when I'm in a foul mood. I bet Maui could tell that Jenny was upset as well.

Usually when I am upset about anything, Maui, who I call the sensitive one, is right there trying to make me feel better, cali can't be bothered, she just wants to play and be silly. with Maui crated, Cali had the chance to be there for me, and she did. it was nice and provided a new type of bonding experience.
FWIW, it takes a lot to get me to this point, but once I'm there, it takes a long time for me to come back down, and all four and two legged are best off getting out of my way in the meantime.

I am the same way. that is the most upset I've ever been with Maui so I needed time.
True. I hate seeing dogs crated all day, especially through no "fault" of their own.

I don't know how long Jenny works. Is it a full-time job? Since she lives with her family, perhaps Maui wasn't actually crated all day, not that all-day crating would have been horrible.

on that day, he was crated about 2 hours. I had no clients, just paperwork to hand in and an hour meeting. I live 10 minutes from the office so not much travel time added to that either.
I love crates and advocate crate training, and use them ... be bothered handling the situation in a more productive way.

I think there are often better solutions than crating, but your posts on the subject are coming off as being ... but even if she did, it's not the end of the world if he was crated for a few hours.

thats my thinking, he was fine and I am fine so all is well. he gets crated very, very seldomly so when he is (usually for short times) I think that is ok. i can see how it becomes a problem for some people (such as Riley being crated in the winter in a cold dark basement for 23 hours a day when he lived with my sister) but that would not happen here
I think there are often better solutions than crating, but ... the world if he was crated for a few hours.

No, it's not the end of the world. Crates are not bad, and necessary for some situations. I always hope/advocate/advise/whatever ... "not enough time or effort". I totally understand how easy it is to fall into "we'll just crate the dog".

if I wasn't headed to work that morning, maui would have had his bath immediately and then needed no crating. I suppose I could have washed him anyway and risked getting in trouble at work but that would not be good for me and thus not good for Maui (mad owners regardless of the reasons they are mad are rarely a good thing for dogs or anyone/thing that has to deal with them)
There is a good chance that Maui is still not feeling well yet, cranky, and just wants to be left alone. Even siblings fight like that; why not dogs who live together. Also, the medicines might be affecting Maui in some way. You don't have to feel guilty about how you feel nor defend your actions; you have done nothing wrong.
I would just avoid feeding or giving them treats when they are in the same room, or feed one of them in the crate. My daughter does that with her two Pugs; one gets fed in the crate (slow eater) to protect him from the other Pug (fast eater) hanging around eyeing his food. That usually ended up with the two of them then going at it.
Other than a couple of those instances, they got along great. The crated dog now feels comfortable and secure when eating.
Today, Maui scared Cali and I because he attacked her (growl/snap and lunge as she backed away so he could ... never let them have treats together so I am willing to work on it as much as I need to.[/nq]Sammie tends to be a guarder, but he's not aggressive about it. He just growls and postures. I don't allow it, though. If he has something good, he will posture and act all tough and I will take it away from him. He doesn't get it back until everyone gets treats again. If he eats his treat, great. If he does his stand over it standing down the universe routine, I take it away. Needless to say, he is much more likely to eat his treats than he used to be.

He still sometimes finds things or saves things and gets stupid over them. I know he has something if he is near anything cloth growling. It means he has hidden something so I can't take it away and is guarding it from the other dogs. I tell him to knock it off, move him over, find whatever it is and it disappears on him forever, as far as he is concerned.
Give them treats together as in the same room but far enough apart that he can't go after Cali, if you want to continue giving treats together. If he doesn't immediately eat his, take it away. He'll soon be too concerned with wolfing it down to worry about guarding. Any growling or guarding of any kind should get him a negative reaction. I find the "you'll either do it my way or you won't do it at all" method to be very effective. I give all my dogs treats at the same time with no grabbing, growling, posturing or problems of any kind. If any of them backslide, it's back to the above until it stops.

Paula
"If you want to invade large swathes of Europe and Asia with an army of highly-mobile horse-archers, simply be Genghis Khan." John Salt
as for even having one, i like to keep it just in case I have a circumstance like this morning ... when I got home so he went in there to keep the furniture clean until I got home from work.

This made me laugh. Every time Scooter decides to go swimming in the pool and then chase Sammie around the dirt, he has to go into his crate until he is dry and clean. He likes his crate, though, because he always gets his favorite monkey when he goes in his crate and Sammie can't steal it to try to incite a game of tug. Scooter doesn't think monkey is a tug toy.

Paula
"Anyway, other people are weird, but sometimes they have candy, so it's best to try to get along with them." Joe Bay
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