1 2 3 4 5 6
I chimed in about my experience as well, and I don't think either Mary or I were writing specifically about ... them to deal with conditions of stress in an acceptable manner, but about all dogs being able to do so.

Fair enough. I didn't get that, exactly, from thread, though.
Ummm...pfoley is perfectly at liberty to post in what seems to be a topic tangential to the original thread.

Duh. I didn't tell him/her otherwise. I'm just baffled at The Pfoley's train of thought.
Yup. They are among the breeds I am most watchful of at the dog park. Most recent was an adolescent ... the dog park entirely because the behavior escalated to an unacceptable level within a span of a couple of weeks.

They tend to "turn on" in the same way that Pit Bulls do. A Boxer who is perfectly friendly with other dogs may not be so friendly after it matures.

Shelly
http://www.cat-sidh.net (the Mother Ship)
http://esther.cat-sidh.net (Letters to Esther)
To emphasize only the beautiful seems to me to be like a mathematical system that only concerns itself with positive numbers. Paul Klee
Getting back to the original subject, I agree that it's ... people will lie or bend the truth about such matters.

The first night of class I ask that people tell me if their dog has a problem with people or ... it isn't labelled aggression.) It's a safety thing, plus it helps to know which dogs need extra attention or assistance.

Actually, if people write anything on the section of our form that asks about issues, even "he LOVES other dogs," I pay special attention. All you really need to answer is No, he isn't aggressive, No, he doesn't bite. So when people feel compelled to expand, I take it as a warning sign no matter what the actual words are. After all, a lot of newbies really have no clue what their dog is telling them, and as we know what a lot of people think of as "really friendly" is anything but.
I thought it was "really funny".
You are right, I don't know anything about Boxers, other than what I have read and observed.
I have two breed books in front of me. Under Boxer temperament, one book says happy, affectionate but a little stubborn; the other one says, alert, playful, very patient and good with children. I don't see anything about a common trait in boxers being aggression. I also meet two boxers on my daily walk, who have good temperaments, and my previous groomer had two boxers who were very friendly. So, I guess I am not "maroon" as you put it. Maybe there are some with questionable dispositions as yours has, but basically I would think by reading the breed descriptions on temperament and by observing the four that I know of, that it is ok to assume the breed is supposed to be pretty good tempered. There are exceptions to every breed. I am talking in general about their traits.
I thought it was "really funny".

So you've said.
You are right, I don't know anything about Boxers, other than what I have read and observed.

Um, where else but reading and observing do you think information comes from?
I have two breed books in front of me. Under Boxer temperament, one book says happy, affectionate but a little stubborn; the other one says, alert, playful, very patient and good with children. I don't see anything about a common trait in boxers being aggression.

I don't know what books they are, but in most of my Boxer books, dog aggression is discussed. If those are the sum total of the behavior descriptions in the books you cited, then those books are likely pretty much worthless.
I also meet two boxers on my daily walk, who have good temperaments, and my previous groomer had two boxers who were very friendly.

Friendliness (toward dogs, I assume), or the lack thereof, isn't the sole measuring stick of whether or not a Boxer has a good temperament.
So, I guess I am not "maroon" as you put it.

If you are basing your assessment of a breed on two books and four individual dogs, then yeah, you're kind of a maroon.
Maybe there are some with questionable dispositions as yours has,

My dog's "questionable disposition" has nothing to do with her dog aggression.
but basically I would think by reading the breed descriptions on temperament and by observing the four that I know of, that it is ok to assume the breed is supposed to be pretty good tempered.

No, it's not okay. You are dealing with inadequate information and a laughably small sample pool.
There are exceptions to every breed. I am talking in general about their traits.

So am I. In general, Boxers tend to be dog aggressive. It's the rule, not the exception.

Shelly
http://www.cat-sidh.net (the Mother Ship)
http://esther.cat-sidh.net (Letters to Esther)
Fear has many eyes and can see things underground. Miguel de Cervantes
I would suggest that you just have a grumpy dog not unlike yourself.
Under Boxer temperament, one book says happy, affectionate but a little stubborn; the other one says, alert, playful, very patient and good with children. I don't see anything about a common trait in boxers being aggression.

There is no relation between sentence one and sentence two, as regards what Shelly (and Suja and I) are talking about. The "temperament" your books are talking about is temperament with HUMANS.
Dog-aggression is an entirely different thing.
What, if anything, do your breed books say about ability to get along with other dogs?
For that matter, what negative comments do your books have about ANY facet of owning Boxers?
Do they, for example, mention that deafness is an issue in the breed? Or that Boxers are considerably more likely to develop a number of cancers than other breeds? Or that some of them have breathing and/or eating problems due to malformation of the muzzle?
I also meet two boxers on my daily walk, who have good temperaments, and my previous groomer had two boxers who were very friendly. So, I guess I am not "maroon" as you >put it.

I dunno about "maroon", but not understanding that "very friendly with humans" doesn't negate "aggressive with select dogs of the same sex" indicates a fairly low level of basic knowlege about dog behaviour.
I am talking in general about their traits.

So are we - that is, Shelly, Suja, and I - and I'm willing to bet that between the three of us we've met about 200% more Boxers than you have, over a much longer period of time.
Not to mention that any honest breed description of them will mention the potential not only for dog aggression, but for protective behaviour.

Here are some links for you:
http://www.yourpurebredpuppy.com/reviews/boxers.html - make sure you read all the way down to point #4 under "If I were considering a Boxer".

http://www.answers.com/topic/boxer - scroll down to "Temperament" (noting on the way that the "History" section discusses the breed's relationship to fighting breeds) and read the ENTIRE SECTION, including the summary.

http://www.savetheboxers.com/ready.php rescue organization - scroll down to "Female Aggression"
http://www.mtbr.org/train.html - this is on the web page of a Boxer Rescue group; rescues are usually more honest about potential problems. Scroll down to the section on "Obedience training"
So are we - that is, Shelly, Suja, and I - and I'm willing to bet that between the three of us we've met about 200% more Boxers than you have,over a much longer period of time.

I was gonna see his 4 dogs and raise him about 20. Decided it was pointless.
Suja
I was gonna see his 4 dogs and raise him about 20.

I think I'd be in the 40-50 range, given 17 years of going to local parks plus nearly 10 of doing agility.
The 4 most memorable Boxers from the park I frequent most, unfortunately, are
1. The two spayed bitches I've spoken of in the past, whose owners had toget rid of one of them after they had a baby because it sparked escalating deadly serious fights between the two, with one Boxer being so protective of the child that she wouldn't tolerate the other.
A year later, they had to get rid of THAT Boxer because she disciplined the toddler - his "puppy license" having run out - for taking a chewie out of her mouth in a way that resulted in serious facial injury.
2. The Boxer cross who played with Brenin when they were both puppies, andat two literally tried to kill him over a tennis ball. That was nearly ten years ago, and Brenin still has the scars on his head and throat.
3. The one whose ASININE dog walker kept bringing him on the trails andletting him off leash, even though he would sink his teeth (and I mean that literally) into any jogger or biker who passed too close to him.
4. The female I mentioned earlier, who at an early age started charging andattacking any smaller female dog she saw.
Ok, so I guess that's really 5.
Decided it was pointless.

Probably so, at least from the standpoint of getting anything through to pfoley. Might help enlighten a bystander, though.
If you are basing your assessment of a breed on two books

And not even books about the breed; sounds like they're the sort of books that give you one page or paragraph per breed, with a thumbnail P.R. sort of description. Such books are USELESS in terms of actually learning about a breed's characteristics, and are often frighteningly inaccurate. They're fun to look at, and handy for visually ID'ing dogs you meet on the street, but that's about it.
and four individual dogs,

I'd be interested in knowing the gender and age of the two that pfoley "meets on daily walks", if by "daily walks" s/he means walks with the female Rott s/he owns.
Show more